Hybrid Tea Rose by Mrs. Herbert Stevens (4 May 2008) via Wikimedia Commons Open Rose Y-DNA Surname Project
 
Hybrid Tea Rose by Mrs. Herbert Stevens (4 May 2008) via Wikimedia Commons
 
Possible Y-DNA STR Cladogram of Group K/K1 ROSE and Group 64 BROWN
as Derived from the Haplogroup R1b-U198 Modal Haplotype
There's little problem deriving the Group K1 ROSEs (i.e., the descendants of John David ROSE) from the Group K ROSEs as they differ by only one mutation (viz., DYS389ii 30 > 31).  In fact, cladistically, there's no particular reason to separate John David's descendants over any other line of descendants in Group K, beyond convenience, simply because John David has so many more tested descendants than the others.  It should not be assumed, however, that John David ROSE, necessarily descends from an American Group K ROSE.  He could easily represent an independent immigration from a common European ROSE ancestor.

To logically connect the GROUP K/K1 ROSEs to the Group 64 BROWNS, we have to assume the mutation from 30 to 31 at DYS389ii happened twice.  The most parsimonious cladogram is:

ROSE-BROWN Cladogram
I see no way here for John David ROSE to be ancestral to the BROWNs, or vice versa.  Their MRCA (Most Recent Common Ancestor) may have been an early ROSE, an early BROWN, or may have existed before the adoption of surnames.  In terms of genetic distance to the MRCA, we are right on the threshold of genealogical time (the period of surname adoption), so there may or may not be an NPE in either line.

CDYa is a highly volatile marker, in this case bouncing back and forth between 38 and 37 in all three groups, so I have excluded it from the cladogram.  Many researchers likewise ignore CDYa/b because of its volatility.

Return to Group K/K1 Results Tables

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Hybrid Tea Rose by Mrs. Herbert Stevens (4 May 2008) via Wikimedia Commons.
 
Hybrid Tea Rose by Mrs. Herbert Stevens (4 May 2008) via Wikimedia Commons